Should the January 6th rioters get pardons?

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Aletheia wrote: Fri Aug 05, 2022 9:03 am
BobCobbMagob wrote: Fri Aug 05, 2022 7:49 am I highly doubt those guys got into any trouble either.
The ones who could be identified were put in prison
https://www.independent.ie/world-news/e ... 80417.html
Ella Pickover

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England????
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That’s South East London, so I’m not sure what’s politically going on over there…

But if you’re in a wheelchair and can’t make a fast getaway, maybe a life of crime is not for you. There’s a lot of other things to do with the day than loot stores, let’s try those…
Aletheia wrote: Fri Aug 05, 2022 9:03 am
BobCobbMagob wrote: Fri Aug 05, 2022 7:49 am I highly doubt those guys got into any trouble either.
The ones who could be identified were put in prison
https://www.independent.ie/world-news/e ... 80417.html
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Lemons wrote: Thu Aug 04, 2022 9:39 pm
BionicBunny wrote: Thu Aug 04, 2022 9:12 pm No! But i also think the riots done in several cities during BLM protests were not taken seriously enough and the same people who are constantly talking about Jan 6th either ignored or brushed off the MANY riots going on. The only riot they care about is the January 6th one because it fits their agenda.
You don’t see the difference between looting a Bloomingdale’s and trying to hunt down the Vice President while chanting “hang Mike Pence” after someone built a noose?

Thousands were arrested during BLM protests when they were witnessed committing a crime. Hundreds were arrested at the Capital when evidence showed them committing a crime. I’m not sure you get the seriousness of the attack on the Capital and what was very close to happening on Jan 6.
I’m not talking about you, my comment is very general.

I haven’t seen a lot of Democrats give Pence credit for putting his life at risk by going against Trump to do the right thing and still feel he did not do enough.

That said, Democrats needs to pick a lane on this. If it’s serious enough to lock people up for it, it’s serious enough to give him credit for taking that risk.

It just doesn’t seem genuine to make it a big deal or minimize it based on what fits the narrative.

Again, this is general because I don’t know if that’s how you feel so I’m not accusing you of it.
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BionicBunny wrote: Fri Aug 05, 2022 12:42 am
Lemons wrote: Thu Aug 04, 2022 9:39 pm
BionicBunny wrote: Thu Aug 04, 2022 9:12 pm No! But i also think the riots done in several cities during BLM protests were not taken seriously enough and the same people who are constantly talking about Jan 6th either ignored or brushed off the MANY riots going on. The only riot they care about is the January 6th one because it fits their agenda.
You don’t see the difference between looting a Bloomingdale’s and trying to hunt down the Vice President while chanting “hang Mike Pence” after someone built a noose?

Thousands were arrested during BLM protests when they were witnessed committing a crime. Hundreds were arrested at the Capital when evidence showed them committing a crime. I’m not sure you get the seriousness of the attack on the Capital and what was very close to happening on Jan 6.
Looting Bloomingsdale? Well thanks for proving my point!
Im obviously not talking about looting bloomingsdale or whatever you want to throw in there to down play the seriousness of the riots! Shall i refresh your memory on the buildings being burned down with people in them. The police station? The people shot and killed? One in particular the retired officer who died on the sidewalk outside his friends store trying to stop those murdering looters! How about the numbers of people injured? Properties destroyed? Businesses destroyed? Peoples livelihoods destroyed? The thousands arrested… most of those people got a slap on the wrist and people like you defended their cause. They were excused by people like you.
Yeah! Im not talking about freaking bloomingsdale being looted! And i am talking about people like you who downplayed the whole thing just as you so graciously did just now for all of us. Thank you!!!
Yes, i see the seriousness of Jan 6th and they should not be pardoned, period!!
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/28/us/m ... inson.html

He was tried and convicted.
306/232

But I'm still the winner! They lied! They cheated! They stole the election!
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SouthernIslander wrote: Fri Aug 05, 2022 2:05 pm
Lemons wrote: Thu Aug 04, 2022 9:39 pm
BionicBunny wrote: Thu Aug 04, 2022 9:12 pm No! But i also think the riots done in several cities during BLM protests were not taken seriously enough and the same people who are constantly talking about Jan 6th either ignored or brushed off the MANY riots going on. The only riot they care about is the January 6th one because it fits their agenda.
You don’t see the difference between looting a Bloomingdale’s and trying to hunt down the Vice President while chanting “hang Mike Pence” after someone built a noose?

Thousands were arrested during BLM protests when they were witnessed committing a crime. Hundreds were arrested at the Capital when evidence showed them committing a crime. I’m not sure you get the seriousness of the attack on the Capital and what was very close to happening on Jan 6.
I’m not talking about you, my comment is very general.

I haven’t seen a lot of Democrats give Pence credit for putting his life at risk by going against Trump to do the right thing and still feel he did not do enough.

That said, Democrats needs to pick a lane on this. If it’s serious enough to lock people up for it, it’s serious enough to give him credit for taking that risk.

It just doesn’t seem genuine to make it a big deal or minimize it based on what fits the narrative.

Again, this is general because I don’t know if that’s how you feel so I’m not accusing you of it.
Pence is who Pence is. It wasn’t surprising at all that he did the right thing. Of all the corruption swirling around Trump I don’t think Pence was involved in any of it. He’s a stand up guy who’s just a little bit creepy. I don’t remember anyone criticizing Pence. He did his job and all I heard was praise for him.

The hypocrisy lies with the MAGA cult. They claim to respect their country and respect the police. They show that by spraying bear spray in police faces and attacking them with flagpoles all the while threatening to kill government lawmakers. There is one narrative here and it was all recorded for everyone to see.
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Lemons wrote: Fri Aug 05, 2022 2:31 pm
SouthernIslander wrote: Fri Aug 05, 2022 2:05 pm
Lemons wrote: Thu Aug 04, 2022 9:39 pm

You don’t see the difference between looting a Bloomingdale’s and trying to hunt down the Vice President while chanting “hang Mike Pence” after someone built a noose?

Thousands were arrested during BLM protests when they were witnessed committing a crime. Hundreds were arrested at the Capital when evidence showed them committing a crime. I’m not sure you get the seriousness of the attack on the Capital and what was very close to happening on Jan 6.
I’m not talking about you, my comment is very general.

I haven’t seen a lot of Democrats give Pence credit for putting his life at risk by going against Trump to do the right thing and still feel he did not do enough.

That said, Democrats needs to pick a lane on this. If it’s serious enough to lock people up for it, it’s serious enough to give him credit for taking that risk.

It just doesn’t seem genuine to make it a big deal or minimize it based on what fits the narrative.

Again, this is general because I don’t know if that’s how you feel so I’m not accusing you of it.
Pence is who Pence is. It wasn’t surprising at all that he did the right thing. Of all the corruption swirling around Trump I don’t think Pence was involved in any of it. He’s a stand up guy who’s just a little bit creepy. I don’t remember anyone criticizing Pence. He did his job and all I heard was praise for him.

The hypocrisy lies with the MAGA cult. They claim to respect their country and respect the police. They show that by spraying bear spray in police faces and attacking them with flagpoles all the while threatening to kill government lawmakers. There is one narrative here and it was all recorded for everyone to see.
I have heard people on the left saying that Pence did not do enough to speak out against Trump’s beef with the election. I don’t remember your stance on it either, so that’s why I said my comment wasn’t directly at you specifically.

No, the left is definitely guilty of hypocrisy too. We’ll get a lot further once both parties realize the the opposing side isn’t the only one who is guilty of this.

This isn’t a competition of which side has the worst rioters. Only difference is one reason is more understandable than the other but the actual act itself is no different.

Burning down a police station is wrong and tearing up the capital is also wrong.
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SouthernIslander wrote: Fri Aug 05, 2022 3:32 pm
Lemons wrote: Fri Aug 05, 2022 2:31 pm
SouthernIslander wrote: Fri Aug 05, 2022 2:05 pm

I’m not talking about you, my comment is very general.

I haven’t seen a lot of Democrats give Pence credit for putting his life at risk by going against Trump to do the right thing and still feel he did not do enough.

That said, Democrats needs to pick a lane on this. If it’s serious enough to lock people up for it, it’s serious enough to give him credit for taking that risk.

It just doesn’t seem genuine to make it a big deal or minimize it based on what fits the narrative.

Again, this is general because I don’t know if that’s how you feel so I’m not accusing you of it.
Pence is who Pence is. It wasn’t surprising at all that he did the right thing. Of all the corruption swirling around Trump I don’t think Pence was involved in any of it. He’s a stand up guy who’s just a little bit creepy. I don’t remember anyone criticizing Pence. He did his job and all I heard was praise for him.

The hypocrisy lies with the MAGA cult. They claim to respect their country and respect the police. They show that by spraying bear spray in police faces and attacking them with flagpoles all the while threatening to kill government lawmakers. There is one narrative here and it was all recorded for everyone to see.
I have heard people on the left saying that Pence did not do enough to speak out against Trump’s beef with the election. I don’t remember your stance on it either, so that’s why I said my comment wasn’t directly at you specifically.

No, the left is definitely guilty of hypocrisy too. We’ll get a lot further once both parties realize the the opposing side isn’t the only one who is guilty of this.

This isn’t a competition of which side has the worst rioters. Only difference is one reason is more understandable than the other but the actual act itself is no different.

Burning down a police station is wrong and tearing up the capital is also wrong.
True Pence could have said a little more than he did but he’s prob hoping it all goes away.

Your right it’s not a competition nor is it both sides. That’s why it didn’t make sense that bionic compared them. Reverse it with this narrative - Democrats attack the White House with deadly weapons and try to get at Trump. In the meantime White MAGAs are tearing up cities protesting because they are upset about Democrats passing a bill that will effect them negatively. In this case the Democrats would have done something much more grievous and dangerous. white MAGAs would have been protesting an injustice. Democrats would have been committing treason.

Protests against unfairness or injustice have changed the country for the better. The Boston Tea Party started a revolution. Vietnam protests helped end the war. Civil rights protests started the tear down of Jim Crow laws and brought the start of equality.

BLM was the latest protest about injustice. It became out of control and was too violent but it also started some real change and awareness not unlike the civil rights protests of the 1960’s.

None of these are comparable to Jan 6. A riot where people in charge of the country were willing to make outrageous claims and dangerous lie and a small group of Americans were willing to do their bidding at the expense of a democratically held election. Even if that meant killing elected lawmakers.
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I don't like comparisons between BLM protests in 2020 and the Jan. 6th insurrection. Between 15-26 million people participated in BLM protests and despite them largely being peaceful, violence did break out at a few and over 10,000 were arrested. January 6th insurrection saw less than 15,000 participants with about 800 arrests. The intent of BLM protests was to be peaceful while the intent of Jan. 6th insurrection was to be violent.

That being said, those who committed crimes at either should be charged, and if convicted, punished.
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Lemons wrote: Fri Aug 05, 2022 7:18 pm
SouthernIslander wrote: Fri Aug 05, 2022 3:32 pm
Lemons wrote: Fri Aug 05, 2022 2:31 pm

Pence is who Pence is. It wasn’t surprising at all that he did the right thing. Of all the corruption swirling around Trump I don’t think Pence was involved in any of it. He’s a stand up guy who’s just a little bit creepy. I don’t remember anyone criticizing Pence. He did his job and all I heard was praise for him.

The hypocrisy lies with the MAGA cult. They claim to respect their country and respect the police. They show that by spraying bear spray in police faces and attacking them with flagpoles all the while threatening to kill government lawmakers. There is one narrative here and it was all recorded for everyone to see.
I have heard people on the left saying that Pence did not do enough to speak out against Trump’s beef with the election. I don’t remember your stance on it either, so that’s why I said my comment wasn’t directly at you specifically.

No, the left is definitely guilty of hypocrisy too. We’ll get a lot further once both parties realize the the opposing side isn’t the only one who is guilty of this.

This isn’t a competition of which side has the worst rioters. Only difference is one reason is more understandable than the other but the actual act itself is no different.

Burning down a police station is wrong and tearing up the capital is also wrong.
True Pence could have said a little more than he did but he’s prob hoping it all goes away.

Your right it’s not a competition nor is it both sides. That’s why it didn’t make sense that bionic compared them. Reverse it with this narrative - Democrats attack the White House with deadly weapons and try to get at Trump. In the meantime White MAGAs are tearing up cities protesting because they are upset about Democrats passing a bill that will effect them negatively. In this case the Democrats would have done something much more grievous and dangerous. white MAGAs would have been protesting an injustice. Democrats would have been committing treason.

Protests against unfairness or injustice have changed the country for the better. The Boston Tea Party started a revolution. Vietnam protests helped end the war. Civil rights protests started the tear down of Jim Crow laws and brought the start of equality.

BLM was the latest protest about injustice. It became out of control and was too violent but it also started some real change and awareness not unlike the civil rights protests of the 1960’s.

None of these are comparable to Jan 6. A riot where people in charge of the country were willing to make outrageous claims and dangerous lie and a small group of Americans were willing to do their bidding at the expense of a democratically held election. Even if that meant killing elected lawmakers.
For far-left extremists like Antifa was tearing up shit for political clout, not social injustice or else they would have backed off when a large number of the Black community complained about their behavior doing more damage.

All due respect, I don't advise using Jim Crow and The Civil Rights movement to justify a lot of bullshit coming from the left because you don't know enough about it for the argument to stick. Civil Rights generation WAS NOT going to protests to pick fights and terrorizing people over who they voted for while wearing masks avoid accountability. They weren't inserting themselves into battles uninvited and making shit worse. That is not what fighting for freedom looked like and it's not what got Jim Crow overturned.

Malcolm X started calling out the left on this decades ago and the behavior has gotten much worse. I do not speak for all minorities but exploiting oppression for political clout is just as bad as what happened on January 6. Democrats have got to get out of thinking that they are the lesser of two evils and that makes them better than the right because it doesn't.

I fully agree that rioting is the voice of the unheard, but it was still way too many who ran with that and took it way too far.
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WellPreserved wrote: Fri Aug 05, 2022 7:49 pm I don't like comparisons between BLM protests in 2020 and the Jan. 6th insurrection. Between 15-26 million people participated in BLM protests and despite them largely being peaceful, violence did break out at a few and over 10,000 were arrested. January 6th insurrection saw less than 15,000 participants with about 800 arrests. The intent of BLM protests was to be peaceful while the intent of Jan. 6th insurrection was to be violent.

That being said, those who committed crimes at either should be charged, and if convicted, punished.
Thats still about the same to me because both crowds had a larger percentage of people who did not get violent, but I still agree. IMHO, the lesson to be learned here is that the anger over social injustice (or perceived social injustice) that fuels rioting is a human reaction that is not limited to Black, White, Democrat or Republican. After Jan 6, the right can no longer act like they are above it and can't be pushed to it because it has taken a lot more than a failed election for many to take it there.

I also agree with your last statement because that is really what it boils down to. It's best not to riot if you're not prepared to face the legal repercussions, no matter the reason behind it.
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