Lawmakers in several US states propose legislation to allow spiritual chaplains in public schools

[Slimshandy]

Not sure how I feel.

Yes, separation of church and state.

However, what if some students would feel more comfortable talking to a chaplain vs a mental health counselor?

Why not have both available? This is for the students and not society, who's opinion shouldn't matter.

Students can seek out religious mentoring outside of school.

Once school boards have the options of replacing professionals with religious leaders you create a situation of imposing religion on students who need services. How many religions are going to be represented? Will every student have the option of their personal religious group being among the counselors? Do students need to proclaim their private religious beliefs to the school to access a counselor?

The role of the school counselor is to provide professional guidance based on the academic and psychological needs of the students. They screen for abuse or neglect, identify learning disabilities, and provide academic opportunities for best outcomes. Schools should employee trained professionals in these roles not religious leaders.

Was it suggested that these chaplains would replace school councilors and therapists, or that they would be added on to the faculty or as volunteers in addition to councilors and therapists?

That would make a big difference…

[MonarchMom]

Students can seek out religious mentoring outside of school.

Once school boards have the options of replacing professionals with religious leaders you create a situation of imposing religion on students who need services. How many religions are going to be represented? Will every student have the option of their personal religious group being among the counselors? Do students need to proclaim their private religious beliefs to the school to access a counselor?

The role of the school counselor is to provide professional guidance based on the academic and psychological needs of the students. They screen for abuse or neglect, identify learning disabilities, and provide academic opportunities for best outcomes. Schools should employee trained professionals in these roles not religious leaders.

Was it suggested that these chaplains would replace school councilors and therapists, or that they would be added on to the faculty or as volunteers in addition to councilors and therapists?

That would make a big difference…

The Chaplains Bill, also known as SB 763, was championed by Republican Sen. Mayes Middleton and Rocky Malloy, CEO and founder of the National School Chaplain Association. The bill permits public schools to hire chaplains to provide student support services, funded by safety and security resources. Supporters of the legislation maintain that] chaplains can help fill the gap in school counselor availability, which has worsened during the pandemic.

Critics note that unlike professional counselors, chaplains are not required to have the same level of education and experience. They also lack a focus on student academic and career outcomes. Furthermore, the bill's opponents argue that introducing chaplains into schools reduces the separation between church and state and lacks safeguards to prevent chaplains from proselytizing or evangelizing children. The absence of parental consent for their children to speak with a chaplain is another point of contention.

https://medriva.com/health/public-healt ... c-schools/

[jessilin0113]

I'd be curious about how they are in the school. As a school employee or as a religious figure? In my state, church officials are excepted from mandatory reporting for child abuse, but if they are part of a school, would they be required to? Is that a conflict?

[AZOldGal66]

Not sure how I feel.

Yes, separation of church and state.

However, what if some students would feel more comfortable talking to a chaplain vs a mental health counselor?

Why not have both available? This is for the students and not society, who's opinion shouldn't matter.

Students can seek out religious mentoring outside of school.

Once school boards have the options of replacing professionals with religious leaders you create a situation of imposing religion on students who need services. How many religions are going to be represented? Will every student have the option of their personal religious group being among the counselors? Do students need to proclaim their private religious beliefs to the school to access a counselor?

The role of the school counselor is to provide professional guidance based on the academic and psychological needs of the students. They screen for abuse or neglect, identify learning disabilities, and provide academic opportunities for best outcomes. Schools should employee trained professionals in these roles not religious leaders.

While I appreciate your reply, we won't be agreeing on another topic.

[WellPreserved]

I've received counseling from a chaplain several times in my life - at the hospital and on a military base and I found the counseling really beneficial and I say this as an atheist. BUT, these chaplains were accredited and trained and it appears that states who want to introduce them into public schools are not requiring that accreditation which I think is a HUGE mistake. Also, states are not barring chaplains in public schools from proselytizing (barred in military and hospitals), some are replacing mental health staff with chaplains, and some are requiring parental consent (but none are requiring student consent), and students who practice other religions do not have their own chaplain services. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see how this could be destructive for some kids especially kids of other faiths or no faith or kids who are questioning their faith, gender, sexual orientation, etc.

Also, school counselors and staff are mandated reporters. Chaplains are not.

[Della]

I've received counseling from a chaplain several times in my life - at the hospital and on a military base and I found the counseling really beneficial and I say this as an atheist. BUT, these chaplains were accredited and trained and it appears that states who want to introduce them into public schools are not requiring that accreditation which I think is a HUGE mistake. Also, states are not barring chaplains in public schools from proselytizing (barred in military and hospitals), some are replacing mental health staff with chaplains, and some are requiring parental consent (but none are requiring student consent), and students who practice other religions do not have their own chaplain services. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see how this could be destructive for some kids especially kids of other faiths or no faith or kids who are questioning their faith, gender, sexual orientation, etc.

Also, school counselors and staff are mandated reporters. Chaplains are not.

This is nothing more than a Republican attempt at inserting evangelical churchianity into schools. It's pure indoctrination that I believe will eventually backfire on the party.

[WellPreserved]

I've received counseling from a chaplain several times in my life - at the hospital and on a military base and I found the counseling really beneficial and I say this as an atheist. BUT, these chaplains were accredited and trained and it appears that states who want to introduce them into public schools are not requiring that accreditation which I think is a HUGE mistake. Also, states are not barring chaplains in public schools from proselytizing (barred in military and hospitals), some are replacing mental health staff with chaplains, and some are requiring parental consent (but none are requiring student consent), and students who practice other religions do not have their own chaplain services. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see how this could be destructive for some kids especially kids of other faiths or no faith or kids who are questioning their faith, gender, sexual orientation, etc.

Also, school counselors and staff are mandated reporters. Chaplains are not.

This is nothing more than a Republican attempt at inserting evangelical churchianity into schools. It's pure indoctrination that I believe will eventually backfire on the party.

Of course! Most religions have superiority built into them. This is a tough shell to break through but IMO, it certainly does not belong in our public institutions. Those who feel that their superiority is being challenged are always going to flex muscles and this is exactly what is happening. Long term, it's not going to work. Short term it's going to be shitty.

[Aletheia]

Conservatives also argue religious foundations will act as a "rescue mission" for what they say are public schools' declining values

Speaking about HB514, a bill sponsored by Rep. Keven Stratton, R-Orem, that would allow volunteer chaplains to provide counseling in Utah’s public schools, Chambliss quickly and cheerfully made her point.

“While I would strongly prefer that Utah and other states do not enact bills that mingle religion with state functions, I can personally attest to the fact that The Satanic Temple — committed to the principles of equal religious representation and community service — is ready to embrace this new potential role within Utah’s communities,” Chambliss told the House Education Committee last week.

In other words, if Utah schools open their doors to representatives from other religions, The Satanic Temple wants to get in on the action.

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ALSO:

As legislation that would allow volunteer chaplains in Florida public schools nears passage, The Satanic Temple says it's looking forward to the opportunity.

“Any opportunity that exists for ministers or chaplains in the public sector must not discriminate based on religious affiliation,” wrote The Satanic Temple’s director of ministry, who goes by Penemue Grigori, in an email.

“Our ministers look forward to participating in opportunities to do good in the community, including the opportunities created by this bill, right alongside the clergy of other religions.”

The House has already approved its version of the legislation (HB 931). The Senate bill (SB 7044) got through its final committee earlier this week, setting it up for a final vote in that chamber.

[SallyMae]

Conservatives also argue religious foundations will act as a "rescue mission" for what they say are public schools' declining values

Speaking about HB514, a bill sponsored by Rep. Keven Stratton, R-Orem, that would allow volunteer chaplains to provide counseling in Utah’s public schools, Chambliss quickly and cheerfully made her point.

“While I would strongly prefer that Utah and other states do not enact bills that mingle religion with state functions, I can personally attest to the fact that The Satanic Temple — committed to the principles of equal religious representation and community service — is ready to embrace this new potential role within Utah’s communities,” Chambliss told the House Education Committee last week.

In other words, if Utah schools open their doors to representatives from other religions, The Satanic Temple wants to get in on the action.

______________________________________________________________
ALSO:

As legislation that would allow volunteer chaplains in Florida public schools nears passage, The Satanic Temple says it's looking forward to the opportunity.

“Any opportunity that exists for ministers or chaplains in the public sector must not discriminate based on religious affiliation,” wrote The Satanic Temple’s director of ministry, who goes by Penemue Grigori, in an email.

“Our ministers look forward to participating in opportunities to do good in the community, including the opportunities created by this bill, right alongside the clergy of other religions.”

The House has already approved its version of the legislation (HB 931). The Senate bill (SB 7044) got through its final committee earlier this week, setting it up for a final vote in that chamber.

Now this would only take a few people willing to serve as Satanist chaplains, and would not require buy-in from parents, so I think this would be a better opportunity for Satanists to level the field than the thing with the buses. This is low-budget. So I think the possibility of Satanists at school might be real enough to put the proposal into perspective.