7 years in prison for calling a man, a man…

[jessilin0113]

I suppose this is when we spin away from the topic at hand to begin insulting each other again… sigh.

The question is :Do you think it would be fair that if a man wants to be called a woman, you are forced to call him a woman or spend 7 years in prison?


If that’s not a question you feel comfortable answering, so be it. There’s no need…

Okay, back in. Your question is assuming that transgender women are just men who are pretending to be women. If one (like myself and 40% of women in the US) believes that transgender women ARE women, then how is your question answerable? This is why I said that the question should be re-worded to indicate "mis-gendering" because that is the issue as I stated earlier.

Misgendering someone intentionally or unintentionally should not be an automatic charge of a crime. Misgendering someone intentionally "to stir up hatred with threatening or abusive behavior" should be a crime (in Scotland) in the same way that racially charged or homophobic language "to stir up hatred with threatening or abusive behavior" should be and is a crime (in Scotland). I also make no distinction between mis-gendering a transgender woman or a transgender man.

I'm actually surprised that this is even a debate, lol.

Because these aren’t just questions that arise based on whether or not Brenda down the street should be called Brenda and treated nicely… that is of course true and Brenda should be treated respectfully…



But these are now questions that the safety of women rely on, such as the issue was pointed out:

Do you believe that a rapist who targets women should be able to say they are a woman upon arrest, and then be housed in a women’s prison?

Trans people don't change at the drop of a hat like that. I would think there needs to be evidence to support a transition.

[Slimshandy]

Okay, back in. Your question is assuming that transgender women are just men who are pretending to be women. If one (like myself and 40% of women in the US) believes that transgender women ARE women, then how is your question answerable? This is why I said that the question should be re-worded to indicate "mis-gendering" because that is the issue as I stated earlier.

Misgendering someone intentionally or unintentionally should not be an automatic charge of a crime. Misgendering someone intentionally "to stir up hatred with threatening or abusive behavior" should be a crime (in Scotland) in the same way that racially charged or homophobic language "to stir up hatred with threatening or abusive behavior" should be and is a crime (in Scotland). I also make no distinction between mis-gendering a transgender woman or a transgender man.

I'm actually surprised that this is even a debate, lol.

Because these aren’t just questions that arise based on whether or not Brenda down the street should be called Brenda and treated nicely… that is of course true and Brenda should be treated respectfully…



But these are now questions that the safety of women rely on, such as the issue was pointed out:

Do you believe that a rapist who targets women should be able to say they are a woman upon arrest, and then be housed in a women’s prison?

Trans people don't change at the drop of a hat like that. I would think there needs to be evidence to support a transition.

We all know true transgendered people don’t change at the drop of a hat, and that they’re a majority good people. Equivalent to any other gender demographic.


But there are no laws saying there needs to be evidence of a transition, and there are absolutely no protections for women when it comes to ill intentioned men trying to take advantage of these new laws, and they are… we have evidence, we have specific cases, we have proof and we have women who have been raped because of these new laws that govern women’s prisons.



So in fairness to all Brenda’s out there, there needs to be protections for women as well , not only-transgender women should have protections…

[WellPreserved]

I suppose this is when we spin away from the topic at hand to begin insulting each other again… sigh.

The question is :Do you think it would be fair that if a man wants to be called a woman, you are forced to call him a woman or spend 7 years in prison?


If that’s not a question you feel comfortable answering, so be it. There’s no need…

Okay, back in. Your question is assuming that transgender women are just men who are pretending to be women. If one (like myself and 40% of women in the US) believes that transgender women ARE women, then how is your question answerable? This is why I said that the question should be re-worded to indicate "mis-gendering" because that is the issue as I stated earlier.

Misgendering someone intentionally or unintentionally should not be an automatic charge of a crime. Misgendering someone intentionally "to stir up hatred with threatening or abusive behavior" should be a crime (in Scotland) in the same way that racially charged or homophobic language "to stir up hatred with threatening or abusive behavior" should be and is a crime (in Scotland). I also make no distinction between mis-gendering a transgender woman or a transgender man.

I'm actually surprised that this is even a debate, lol.

Because these aren’t just questions that arise based on whether or not Brenda down the street should be called Brenda and treated nicely… that is of course true and Brenda should be treated respectfully…



But these are now questions that the safety of women rely on, such as the issue was pointed out:

Do you believe that a rapist who targets women should be able to say they are a woman upon arrest, and then be housed in a women’s prison?

Oh no, not another rabbit hole! Sorry but my mind doesn't leap the way yours does

[Slimshandy]

Okay, back in. Your question is assuming that transgender women are just men who are pretending to be women. If one (like myself and 40% of women in the US) believes that transgender women ARE women, then how is your question answerable? This is why I said that the question should be re-worded to indicate "mis-gendering" because that is the issue as I stated earlier.

Misgendering someone intentionally or unintentionally should not be an automatic charge of a crime. Misgendering someone intentionally "to stir up hatred with threatening or abusive behavior" should be a crime (in Scotland) in the same way that racially charged or homophobic language "to stir up hatred with threatening or abusive behavior" should be and is a crime (in Scotland). I also make no distinction between mis-gendering a transgender woman or a transgender man.

I'm actually surprised that this is even a debate, lol.

Because these aren’t just questions that arise based on whether or not Brenda down the street should be called Brenda and treated nicely… that is of course true and Brenda should be treated respectfully…



But these are now questions that the safety of women rely on, such as the issue was pointed out:

Do you believe that a rapist who targets women should be able to say they are a woman upon arrest, and then be housed in a women’s prison?

Oh no, not another rabbit hole! Sorry but my mind doesn't leap the way yours does

What are you talking about?

These are the specific issues being brought up…I didn’t leap anywhere, it’s written in the statement that Jessilin quoted Rowling as saying when it comes to why she is so vocal about the issue.

You seem adamant about not wanting to talk about them, and that is ok, you don’t have to.


But you not wanting to talk about them doesn’t erase them from what is being discussed when it comes to the reality of the situation… pretending these issues are too trivial to discuss doesn’t make the problems go away…

[Della]

Okay, back in. Your question is assuming that transgender women are just men who are pretending to be women. If one (like myself and 40% of women in the US) believes that transgender women ARE women, then how is your question answerable? This is why I said that the question should be re-worded to indicate "mis-gendering" because that is the issue as I stated earlier.

Misgendering someone intentionally or unintentionally should not be an automatic charge of a crime. Misgendering someone intentionally "to stir up hatred with threatening or abusive behavior" should be a crime (in Scotland) in the same way that racially charged or homophobic language "to stir up hatred with threatening or abusive behavior" should be and is a crime (in Scotland). I also make no distinction between mis-gendering a transgender woman or a transgender man.

I'm actually surprised that this is even a debate, lol.

Because these aren’t just questions that arise based on whether or not Brenda down the street should be called Brenda and treated nicely… that is of course true and Brenda should be treated respectfully…



But these are now questions that the safety of women rely on, such as the issue was pointed out:

Do you believe that a rapist who targets women should be able to say they are a woman upon arrest, and then be housed in a women’s prison?

Oh no, not another rabbit hole! Sorry but my mind doesn't leap the way yours does

"There are relatively few trans prisoners in Scotland.


The latest Scottish Prison Service statistics said there were 12 trans women and three trans men between October and December 2022. There were 7,019 male prisoners and 265 female inmates."

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-64796926

[Slimshandy]

Just released half an hour ago-

Her comments are not considered to be against the law.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-68712471

[Della]

Just released half an hour ago-

Her comments are not considered to be against the law.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-68712471

See, you got all up in arms over nothing.

[Slimshandy]

Just released half an hour ago-

Her comments are not considered to be against the law.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-68712471

See, you got all up in arms over nothing.

If that’s what asking for opinions is…

[PoplarGrove]

So yes? Misgendering someone should be 7 years in prison?

New Hate Crime Act in Scotland which "creates a new crime of "stirring up hatred" relating to age, disability, religion, sexual orientation, transgender identity or being intersex" and conviction carries a maximum sentence of 7 years. It's not important whether or not I agree with the law as it's Scottish law. What is important is whether or not Scottish voters agree with the law and it's apparent that they do.

You are smart enough to know that simply misgendering someone is not going to land a person in prison so why phrase it that way?

I am all for countries enacting laws that offer protection to marginalized groups so yes, I agree with the law with regards to Scotland.

Because that is part of the issue… and I don’t think it’s apparent that they do since protests are now happening in front of government buildings, half of Scottish people disagree, and their elected officials are saying things like “The SNP MP Joanna Cherry has said she has no doubt that the new law “will be weaponised by trans rights activists to try to silence, and worse still criminalise, women who do not share their beliefs”.

Rowling is being threatened with 7 years in prison if she does not call A man who has been harassing her, a woman.




Many Scottish people are saying It’s really a first step in making telling the truth a crime…

In her case the misgendering is stirring up hatred. She's misgendering a person because she feels they don't have the right to be referred to by the pronouns she prefer. She's being asked to use the pronouns the person's gender aligns with and she refuses. This isn't a case of accidental misgendering.