Free speech

[Lemons]

Her employer does have a right to comment on it. That too is freedom of speech. They also have a right to decide whether she remains employed with them freedom of speech doesn’t mean freedom from consequences.

They did comment and that was fine. If it starts to be a common policy that people are fired for publicly stating an unpopular opinion wouldn’t that be the beginning of the end of free speech?

It is pretty common for people to be fired for things they post on social media. Free speech isn’t free of consequences. Words matter, if you, general you, are not willing to accept this then maybe you, again general, should decide how much those words matter. No, it wouldn’t be the beginning of the end of free speech.

This wasn’t one of those statements that someone should be fired over. I understand some are.

[Traci_Momof2]

I think it’s just shocking to see someone come out and say what she feels so honestly. I don’t think her employer had any business commenting on it, she had the right to say it.
I hope she’s not canceled.

Her employer does have a right to comment on it. That too is freedom of speech. They also have a right to decide whether she remains employed with them freedom of speech doesn’t mean freedom from consequences.

They did comment and that was fine. If it starts to be a common policy that people are fired for publicly stating an unpopular opinion wouldn’t that be the beginning of the end of free speech?

No. Being fired is not a punishment put on you by your government. Free speech protects you from being punished by your government for stating your opinion. It has nothing to do with private employers.

Now if your employer IS the government, that could create a grey area and I'm not sure how that works. But outside of that, being fired for stating an opinion has nothing to do with free speech.

[WellPreserved]

Her employer does have a right to comment on it. That too is freedom of speech. They also have a right to decide whether she remains employed with them freedom of speech doesn’t mean freedom from consequences.

They did comment and that was fine. If it starts to be a common policy that people are fired for publicly stating an unpopular opinion wouldn’t that be the beginning of the end of free speech?

It is pretty common for people to be fired for things they post on social media. Free speech isn’t free of consequences. Words matter, if you, general you, are not willing to accept this then maybe you, again general, should decide how much those words matter. No, it wouldn’t be the beginning of the end of free speech.

I agree that this isn't a free speech issue but do find it concerning that the outrage wasn't about what she said but about who she said it about. Personally, I found her tweet distasteful but probably would have thought nothing about it if it were said about someone else, like Putin. Probably given her families experience, the monarchy and by extension QEII was worse than Putin. I also found it disconcerting that her tweet was taken down yet she did not violate any of Twitter's terms of service.

[Lemons]

Her employer does have a right to comment on it. That too is freedom of speech. They also have a right to decide whether she remains employed with them freedom of speech doesn’t mean freedom from consequences.

They did comment and that was fine. If it starts to be a common policy that people are fired for publicly stating an unpopular opinion wouldn’t that be the beginning of the end of free speech?

No. Being fired is not a punishment put on you by your government. Free speech protects you from being punished by your government for stating your opinion. It has nothing to do with private employers.

Now if your employer IS the government, that could create a grey area and I'm not sure how that works. But outside of that, being fired for stating an opinion has nothing to do with free speech.

I didn’t say it was illegal to fire her. But is that the kind of country we want to live in? The threat of losing your job because you have an unpopular opinion? A trend like that could create some real oppressiveness and fear to say what you think.

[hotspice58]

Elizabeth was a colonizer and oppressor. That’s being glossed over. Did she start the crap that happened in Africa? No.. Did she stop it? If she did, it wasn’t right away. I can’t believe Twitter took that down with everything else that’s allowed.

[Lemons]

Did Queen Elizabeth herself commit atrocities towards Nigeria? If not then it’s a bit like blaming Joe Biden for the Trail of Tears. I can understand the professor’s anger but not for wishing torture on a woman who had nothing to do with the atrocities. All countries, probably including Nigeria itself has a dark past. All the leaders can do is acknowledge it, make reparations if they can, and do better.

Yes Queen Elizabeth, the monarchy and the British military committed atrocities after the uprising for independence. No , that comparison isn’t even close.

There was a civil war between tribes in Kenya but Mau Mau also fought White settlers who stole their land. The British created detention camps detaining tens of thousands of supporters of independence.

It’s complicated and no one comes out of it completely clean. But the Queen during this era was not there to smile and have tea parties.

I admit I know nothing about Kenya’s civil war which was why I asked. I will have to read thoroughly to get an understanding of it. I won’t say the professor isn’t wrong for being angry, just that i can’t blame her employer for putting out her views aren’t theirs. After all she just wished unending pain on the queen or words to that affect.

There’s a book called Britain’s Gulag” written by a Harvard historian named Caroline Elkins that describes what happened. Most documents were burned when the British left but some have been recovered recently. There are great articles written too.

Also three Kenyans sued recently for reparations and won. Held in concentration camps one of the men was castrated with a clipper tool.

Since the monarchy is on its last legs hopefully their government can acknowledge the damage they have done in so many countries and apologize.

[SouthernIslander]

For the comment or for other things?

Similar comments like the one in the OP about her past and death.

For some reason I thought you’d meant Dr Uju Anya, not Queen Elizabeth

Oh no. LOL! I don’t even know who that is. lol

[Traci_Momof2]

They did comment and that was fine. If it starts to be a common policy that people are fired for publicly stating an unpopular opinion wouldn’t that be the beginning of the end of free speech?

No. Being fired is not a punishment put on you by your government. Free speech protects you from being punished by your government for stating your opinion. It has nothing to do with private employers.

Now if your employer IS the government, that could create a grey area and I'm not sure how that works. But outside of that, being fired for stating an opinion has nothing to do with free speech.

I didn’t say it was illegal to fire her. But is that the kind of country we want to live in? The threat of losing your job because you have an unpopular opinion? A trend like that could create some real oppressiveness and fear to say what you think.

Honestly I think we have for quite some time. #1 - People get fired every single day for a lot less than an unpopular opinion. That's the free employment market. When employees can quit for no reason at all, and employers can fire for no reason at all, then this is what you get. #2 - Employers have the right to protect the image of their business to a certain degree. I work for a CPA. If I go blathering around town about "I think he's a crappy CPA, I don't think you should give him your business at all" should he really be forced to keep me as an employee all in the name of "free speech"? I'm just voicing my opinion after all. Or should he be able to fire me and hire someone else who at least won't bad mouth the business and bring down his profits? Shouldn't he be able to have someone employed who projects the image that he is looking for?

The potential for being fired for your speech is the consequences that people say "free speech" doesn't protect you from. Say what you want. You won't get jailed for it, but you might potentially get fired for it. It's already been happening for a long time and probably will continue for a long time.

But in reality, most people don't get bit in the ass by that concept because most people use a level of common sense. I might have strong anti-gun opinions of my own, but I don't go voicing them to our gun shop owning client because common sense tells me that is not appropriate in the workplace.

[Deleted User 1977]

My understanding is that the professor wrote this on Twitter and Twitter deleted it. She apparently came back for more though I'm unsure on that as I'm no longer on Twitter and have only read her story on news sites.

Freedom of Speech should exist but that pertains to everyone, including those who oppose her views.

Her employer almost had an obligation to respond as it's been made public which university she works for.

That’s fine. I’m just glad the Woke police didn’t demand her to be fired.

Who would be the "woke police (whatever this implies)" in this case?

[RIZZY1]

Did Queen Elizabeth herself commit atrocities towards Nigeria? If not then it’s a bit like blaming Joe Biden for the Trail of Tears. I can understand the professor’s anger but not for wishing torture on a woman who had nothing to do with the atrocities. All countries, probably including Nigeria itself has a dark past. All the leaders can do is acknowledge it, make reparations if they can, and do better.

Yes Queen Elizabeth, the monarchy and the British military committed atrocities after the uprising for independence. No , that comparison isn’t even close.

There was a civil war between tribes in Kenya but Mau Mau also fought White settlers who stole their land. The British created detention camps detaining tens of thousands of supporters of independence.

It’s complicated and no one comes out of it completely clean. But the Queen during this era was not there to smile and have tea parties.

I admit I know nothing about Kenya’s civil war which was why I asked. I will have to read thoroughly to get an understanding of it. I won’t say the professor isn’t wrong for being angry, just that i can’t blame her employer for putting out her views aren’t theirs. After all she just wished unending pain on the queen or words to that affect.

I'm not as well versed on African history as I am in other continents. The Queen is a figurehead, moreso than a President. She never had full power to do anything. She had an influence, a strong one, but she wasn't the one giving orders. That was Parliament and House of Commons. While every country had to fight for independence from Great Britain, the monarchy then made it official by "granting" it, which wasn't really necessary, probably to save face. This is, of course, a simplified version of events. I know what happened was brutal; every country which had a great empire at one time has been brutal so I don't want to downplay that. I guess I would expect more of the hate to be geared towards the Prime Ministers of the time. I think the person's words were justified, I agree that we just aren't used to people in other countries to let loose so soon after someone's death. I thought that was more of an American thing.